I am your host, AShira Nelson, and this is PBS Western Reserve Forum 360 where we have a global outlook from a local view.

Today I'm interviewing Gloria Ware, the CEO and president of GTB Advisors, a firm dedicated to helping entrepreneurs, business owners and investors create lasting economic impact through strategic business growth and acquisition.

Today, we're going to discuss exploring different businesses, how businesses can win and how to navigate the business process and what resources are available to those ready to take a leap into business ownership.

So hello.

Welcome.

Hello.

Thank you.

How are you?

I'm doing well.

Awesome, awesome.

So this is your second time on Forum 360.

Yes, yes.

Okay, okay.

So welcome back.

I'm happy to be back.

Enjoy another host.

Yes.

So Leah.

Leah Love, the beautiful.

Leah Love.

Amazing.

Leah Love.

Yes.

Interviewed you last time.

So we're going to build on that.

Okay.

You recently, did a workshop that I was inspired by.

I hate that I couldn't make it, but I had to have you on to talk about those things.

Okay.

To discuss.

So can you tell us a little bit about your background and what first drew you to entrepreneurship counseling and business advising?

Yeah.

So, I am a Cleveland native.

Okay, so born in Cleveland, but I also spent time in Los Angeles and Detroit growing up and graduated from the Ohio State University with a degree in international business.

And during my time at the Ohio State University, I worked, at the Office of Black Student Programs, which was in the student union.

And so it was my responsibility to develop programs for students.

And I encountered a black enterprise magazine, which I had never seen before during that time.

I think I was like a junior.

Okay.

And I saw, like, all these amazing photos of, like, people and stories about, like, business executives and entrepreneurs and I was like, wow, this looks really amazing.

And I was a business major, but I didn't really know what I wanted to do.

as a business major I didn't could never really see myself in corporate.

I think just because I had never really seen others.

like me in corporate.

Yeah.

And I was like, oh my gosh, like entrepreneurship.

Like that's it.

So one of my first programs I did was on entrepreneurship.

And so introducing entrepreneurship and various resources that business owners could tap into.

To the students that were on campus, but also opened it up to the community.

So the, the neighborhood people that were in the neighborhood and I invited, people from the state of Ohio, which had, the Department of Development, and that's where you would go to get support for starting your businesses.

And then I found out that after the event, it was very well attended that people that actually gone to, it's Broad Street, the, state of Ohio offices and started the process of starting their businesses.

And from there I was, I was hooked.

So, gradually when I graduated, went on to become a banker.

Okay.

And, and then have been working with small business owners for three decades, helping them to access capital, helping them to manage their cash.

Worked in banking up until 2010 and also had a stint as a nonprofit banker so I also ensured that nonprofits had the cash and resources that they need.

But I left and I went to work for a venture capital entity kind of slash venture capital economic development.

And in that process, got to see work with a lot of startup businesses and see the venture capital side, which is very different from the banking side, which is much more, very conservative and not very risk tolerant.

And your capital is still there's still some risk management strategies, but like, they're more willing to take a risk.

Okay.

And then did some work with grants.

So I actually funded business support organizations across the state of Ohio and their program.

So I also got to see kind of like what that look like outside of Cleveland.

Okay.

But super passionate about entrepreneurship I do believe that done right, that's the key.

It can be a tool to build wealth as individuals, but the key is done right?

Absolutely.

I agree 100%.

Let's talk about that.

I want to emphasize or follow up with the point of done right.

Yeah.

How do you think what are the steps for it to be done right.

Let's just get right into it.

I think the biggest step is to know what you want the business to do for you personally.

Okay.

And so many people start a business out of a passion, which I think is great because that is what helps to keep you through the ups and downs, to keep you motivated.

Yes.

And but we don't always think about what is it I want this business to do for me financially.

Okay.

Like what is the end game.

Yeah.

For this in terms of the wealth that is going to specific wealth specific income and is this the right business.

Is the business that I am starting or growing or buying align with my financial goals.

Okay.

And then this is where the banker side of me comes into play.

Because we're as bankers, you're always paying attention to the money side of it.

And you're looking at things like, do we want to make a loan to this business, which is in this industry, which typically has low profit margins?

Yeah.

So those are the questions that we're asking ourselves as bankers.

But often business owners don't ask that question just because they don't know.

Right.

Right.

Yeah.

Great point.

Great point.

So what inspired you to host the, Buying a Winning Business workshop?

Actually, so I do a lot of work with business support organizations, and I work I do work with the foundation and National Foundation that funds this work and this it's called entrepreneurship through acquisition.

It's like as a pathway.

It's one way to start a business is to buy an existing business or to grow your existing business or footprint is to buy an existing business.

And that's how the Amazons and the Googles and the Facebooks of the world, that's how they grew by buying other businesses and they continue to do that.

And so I was doing research for this organization, and this was something that was of interest to the and the entity.

And so I just kind of started doing more research on it, but it was also on my radar, as well.

I was hearing some business support organizations talk about it.

I attended an event that, the Tri-c Center for entrepreneurs had on entrepreneurship through acquisition.

And, I just as a member of a, I was on the board of a nonprofit organization that actually it was more of a, a merger.

Okay.

I kind of had been involved with a little bit of that, but, was really intrigued by the idea of, oh, like, this is this is kind of a hack.

There's a lot of risk associated with starting a business.

And even if you pick the right industry and growing it, but if you buy the right business for the right purpose, you've de-risked it because they already have customers, they already have an infrastructure.

They are to have employees.

Right.

So it can be a great, a great tool for business growth.

And it was something that wasn't really being discussed in our community.

Very true.

Yeah.

Very true.

We never talk about it.

All I hear about is the downside of when someone, a black business is selled.

Yes, exactly.

Exactly right.

Exactly the disconnect.

Yeah.

So exactly.

Kind of nice to hear about the acquisition and learn the steps that you should take or consider for acquisition.

Right.

There's so much negativity around.

So yes.

And the other thing was that, you know, there was a lot of conversation around entrepreneurship through acquisition, but it was targeted towards a certain type of person, right, that had a very strong network, that had resources that had, you know, wealth to invest.

And I wanted to bring it down.

I wanted to make it more accessible.

Yeah.

And think about the types of businesses that are how you should be thinking about your business.

Right.

One day is like, maybe I want to sell this business, or if I do transition it, how do I transition it to my children or family members or employees is another route.

But also like, how can we make it so that the it's the topic is more accessible and relatable to a greater number of business owners or aspiring business owners.

Yeah.

So can you walk us through like, high level someone like some steps that someone should follow when buying the idea or yeah, buying a business or idea from someone else?

Yes, I think because again, it goes back to that question of how does this how do you want this business to serve you?

Okay.

Finacially.

Always start there It's always about the numbers.

Yeah.

You know I would say that's that's that's key among other things as well too, in terms of your lifestyle, the type of lifestyle that you want to have.

Great point.

Okay.

How are you planning to what role are you planning to play in in the acquisition?

Are you going to hire a person that's going to be the operator or the general manager, or is this something that you're going to do personally?

So I think really understanding that piece of it, talking, interviewing.

Yeah.

You're getting business owners, period.

Okay.

Just to get a sense, if you're new in business.

Yeah.

Get a sense of what does it mean to operate a business, operate a business with employees.

And then I think it's important for you to think about, the types of industries that you want to you want to, get into and then do your homework.

So before we had that workshop, we had a workshop called Proven in Profit and it was really helping business owners bringing market research resources down to your average business owner.

Yeah.

But like, helping you to these are questions that you should be thinking about, information you should consider before you start your business.

Or as you're growing, thinking about establishing a new product or going to a new market.

And here are resources available for you.

Okay.

So doing your homework on that.

I would say start with the library.

Okay.

So we at that event, we actually had, Sarah Dobransky from the Cleveland Public Library downtown branch.

She's like the lead research librarian.

Talk to us about all of the resources that are available, people that are there, librarians that are waiting for you to come and answer research questions because most of us are not researchers.

Right.

So there are people to help direct you.

Establish a relationship with your banker should be probably the branch manager or the business banker.

Okay.

And just start asking them questions about do they finance business acquisitions?

What should you look for?

Think of your banker as a resource because you were the client.

Yeah, right.

As a resource to help you to navigate like any future financial plans that you might have.

Okay.

And so I always encourage people to establish relationships with multiple bankers early before you, even before you even need any money.

Yeah.

Because that is how you increase your odds of being approved.

Because number one, you're learning along the way of how what they look for, the types of businesses that they will finance, that they won't finance, what they're looking for in you, but they also get to know you and your story and are more willing to pitch you or go very strong.

Right.

A decision table in encouraging like the deal to be done.

So and then talking to other there's, there is a, there's a group, there's an organization called Promise Partners.

Okay.

It's out of based out of Case Western Reserve University and it's like a members.

Yeah.

Only type organization.

But their focus is on helping you to navigate the process of starting a business.

Okay.

And then you're there with other people that have started businesses in the past.

And so, like, you've got people that you can talk to and okay and get questions to.

And a lot of it is also about like a lot of the information that you get about finding business opportunities.

There's a number of sources and we can discuss those but comes through the grapevine okay.

So at that event we had, Tangela Scott from Cleveland Bouncers, a bounce house.

She was at Goldman Sachs program with me, and she and her sons bought a bounce house business, a 20 year old bounce house Oh they bought the business.

Yeah.

Okay.

And I don't know if they were looking for a business to buy, but she, her story was that she served on the the YMCA, Hillcrest YMCA board, which is South Euclid, Lyndhurst, okay, with the owner.

And just through his observations of her and her sons.

Yeah.

he was thinking about making the transition, but he really cared about his business and his employees and had been kind of checking her out and saying, you know, I think she would be like a really good person that I would like to consider to buy my business.

So this is the other piece of you just never know who in your circle is evaluating you and what opportunities are being presented to you, and people are making judgments or assessments about without to even.

Right?

Yeah.

So this is why I encourage people to get out.

Yeah.

And expand their network.

You know, serve your community, serve on boards and go to networking events because that's how you find the right accountant, the right attorneys, the right business valuation person.

Absolutely.

It's by getting out and kind of hearing through those, those conversations.

Yeah.

Well, this is Forum 360 where we have a global outlook from a local view.

Today we're interviewing Gloria Ware, and we're talking about the process of what it takes to buy a business, how to grow it and to sustain a successful business.

So to continue our conversation, what do you think are some, things that buyers should evaluate?

Well, you did talk about the financial metrics, the doing the market research, which I'm so glad you talked about that too, because I always sell my network that sometimes we jump into it.

Yeah.

And people don't even talk about, like, serving the community like that or figuring out what area that they even want to be.

Absolutely.

Or like people say in my neighborhood, oh, I'm going to open up a, let's just say, a smoothie place.

And I'm like, well, did you survey the market to see if there was a need?

Exactly.

Or did you just like like the idea.

Exactly.

So yeah.

Yes.

Okay.

Yeah.

So what are some other things that people have to make sure they do or consider before buying a business?

Well, definitely say building a team.

Okay.

Right.

Starting because there is a lot that might be out of our scope of expertise.

Yeah, of decisions and information that you need to have.

So starting early with identifying a team of accountants that specialize in business acquisition.

Any accountant.

Yeah.

Accountants that specialize in business acquisition.

Good point.

Understand the financial analysis side of accounting.

Yeah.

So almost more really more of a chief financial officer or a fractional chief financial.

Okay.

I like that.

Their job is to think about business strategy.

And not a lot of many accounts focus on taxes.

Or the reporting for tax.

Exactly.

So that's the biggest caveat.

And then through your network and then there are people and typically these people are have a finance background valuation firms okay to help you with that process.

And I think probably a lot of these people are probably accountants as well.

Okay.

And attorneys.

Oh, that's huge because what kind of negotiation attorneys play helping you to negotiate, okay.

With your negotiation strategy.

And then helping you to understand contractually what you're buying.

Oh, what are you buying?

Okay.

Right.

Like, are both parties on the same page in terms of what they think they were buying versus what they're actually buying?

Okay.

Have you seen cases where people wasn't on the same page?

I have, you know, I haven't been that exposed to people in the trenches of that.

But, I, I have definitely read about it.

Okay.

Because are you buying just kind of the physical assets of a business?

Okay.

Or are you also buying all of their problems?

So like, are there lawsuits that the business okay had that year.

Are there other like issues.

Yeah.

That were there we might be subject to lawsuits happening in the business.

Having your lender or your banker involved because it's one thing for you to negotiate with the seller is another thing for you to get funding to finance that.

The bank might say, well, that's not you know, you're financing that industry, right?

Or this is what we would need.

And they're reviewing the financial statements.

I have been involved in situations where there were a discussion about kind of the value of the business and the income streams of the business.

So and the in and but when it, when it was time for the owner to produce the tax returns, it didn't line up with the conversation.

Oh yeah.

And that's because a lot of many accountants are saying always encouraging people to save money.

And so therefore your tax returns are making it look like you're not making as much money so profitable.

The other one is how much of the business is relying on that owner.

Great point.

Like it might be a charismatic owner that knows everyone.

Yeah.

And everyone's doing business with them and they have the all the many of the employees are family members.

Oh yeah.

So when the owner goes away, is there still a business.

Rights.

Right.

And this is why if you're as you're building your own business, you want to think about creating a business that could operate without you.

Okay.

So that if you do decide to sell, that's not a question.

It's like, oh, when you go away, is the business going to last?

Yeah, a lot of the ways that people mitigate that is having a, a contract with where the owner stays on for a while.

Yeah.

Okay.

I have seen that.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well they'll do like six months or a year.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

But also in the employees.

Yeah.

You want to know.

Yeah.

What kind of employees are you acquiring and are they based upon.

You're buying this business because you think it's like flipping a house, like, say, flip?

You know, maybe you want to hold on to it, but you're thinking, like, you know what?

I feel like this business, I could take it.

I could increase sales by, you know, three times.

Yeah.

If I implemented this technology, if I did, you know, these built this new infrastructure.

If I expanded our markets.

But like, do you have the right employees in place that are willing to do that?

Yeah, I was doing a risk.

Me, a colleague and I, we were doing a, we did a webinar series on risk management.

Okay.

We're on four business owners, and one of the business owners was sharing how they had these ideas about investing in technology.

But then their employees were refusing to use the technology, and they were the type of employees that are difficult to get.

And retain.

And so it's like okay, it sounds it sounded good.

But yes, you don't, you know, you don't have these employees that are willing to use the tech.

Yeah.

Because all employees are not open to the technology.

A.I.

Yes, they're afraid of that I mean just even my laptop, it's just that.

Yeah, some are very afraid of technology.

So on the upside, what are some of the benefits of acquiring existing businesses versus starting a new one.

Well, you again, you're acquiring that expertise okay.

So you've got this business has also has a brand established.

Yes.

It's identify like who their target customers are and which customer serve them well.

They have ideally like operations and processes.

So you don't have to start over trying to build that and learn on the job there.

They might be in a market that you're trying to expand to say, for example, if you have an existing business and you're like, hey, I really would like to do business in, on the West Coast.

So instead of you having to go to the West Coast and set up shop and try to learn the rules and regs, oh, there might be a business that's already set up there, and you could either do a joint venture with that business, which might be a good way to kind of get started on seeing how well you work together and seeing maybe if the West Coast is for you.

But you could also acquire that.

I do remember reading a story about JP Morgan Chase, and I think this is where I first became exposed in this concept, both like kind of stepping outside of your business ownership box and growing your business through joint ventures.

Right.

So that I mean, this is this was like about 1875 or 1895, this is what JP Morgan was doing.

So was JP Morgan.

So and he'd say, hey, I want to do business in Germany, who's already in Germany that I can partner with?

Okay, let's do that.

Now I'm making money in Germany without this huge investment.

Yes, yes.

So they formed a separate LLC to do that.

And then that's just kind of how it works.

And again, but thinking back to, [inaudible] Facebook when it bought Instagram and then bought- yeah, all of those businesses that we love.

And sometimes people buy a business to eliminate competition, but sometimes they buy because they see that business has maybe they have intellectual property that you want.

Right.

And that's one way to get that intellectual property.

Very great point.

Very great point.

Because I witnessed the Facebook and yeah Instagram acquisition.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So what are the biggest risks and disadvantage when buying a business even if it looks successful on paper.

Yeah.

One of the risks might be that you just not happy.

Okay.

Right.

It's if you're going to be the operator, you find that you just.

And maybe you go from being a solo entrepreneur or managing 2 or 3 employees, and now you've bought a business that has 25 employees.

Yeah.

Is this does that fit your lifestyle?

Okay.

Right.

And if not, there's ways of again, doing this where you - bring on an operator, a person that that's their role to do that.

Okay.

But it can be a lot.

It can be a shift to have from having limited I mean, have running a business is hard regardless of how many team members you have, but it can be a huge lifestyle shift.

The other one is again, just the and there's an industry down like the industry changes.

So this is why it's important for you to also look at not where the current industry is now, but what could happen.

What's down the road.

We talked.

Yeah.

We were talking about, in the workshop, how their insurance costs went from $5000 to $15,000 in just one year.

Okay.

So just that's why it's really important to have your pulse on the industry and bringing in also a team of advisors.

So people that are familiar with that industry that can give you kind of like the insights, guess on what to look out for and what to consider.

You know, there could be regulatory changes that happen.

You know, the economy could change, which could affect the, the industry.

Because we've seen a lot of that these days.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

And your employees, you just might your employees just may not.

You may not be it for them.

Yeah, right.

That's true.

Cause chemistry and culture.

Sometimes it's just what they do.

Stay.

Yes.

Right there.

Great point.

Yeah.

What is the.

Is the seller going to go and open up a new business and then take those employees.

Oh.

So there's just so much so many different things that can happen.

Okay.

Yeah.

So if people want more information about acquisitions and buying a business, where can they go for more resources?

Yeah.

So there's actually coming up with the I actually have a toolkit.

Okay.

So but and it has access to podcast, websites that you can go to to look for businesses, access to some of the things that we talked about in terms of additional information and resources.

There are some meetup groups.

There's like some meetup groups in Cleveland where, they talk about, you know, purchasing businesses.

There's promise partners, which.

Okay.

Entrepreneurship through acquisition, kind of like mastermind groups.

Okay.

That's what they do.

Yeah.

Sign up for some newsletters on the topic.

Do a Google search for, like, entrepreneurship through acquisition or mergers and acquisitions, small business.

How can they get access to your toolkit?

Yeah.

So just email me at G. GWare@GTB advisors LLC.

Awesome, awesome.

Well, today our conversation was with Gloria Ware.

She offered invaluable insight into what it takes to buying, growing, and sustaining a business.

To learn more about GTB advisors and the resources available again, visit her website.

It is GTB advisors llc.com or her email that she mentioned.

I am your host, AShira Nelson, and this is Forum 360.

Where we have a global outlook from a local view.

Until next time I'll see you all very soon.

Forum 360 is brought to you by John S and James L Knight Foundation, the Akron Community Foundation, Hudson Community Television, the Rubber City Radio Group, Sha Jewish Community Center of Akron, Blue Green, Electric Impulse Communications, and Forum 360 supporters.